Author Topic: Flintstones Gnd short Row 1 is stuck closed  (Read 2598 times)

Offline Steelcurtainlou

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Flintstones Gnd short Row 1 is stuck closed
« on: March 21, 2017, 10:20:20 AM »
I repaired a broken LED lamp and when I lowered the game, this Gnd short message came up. I've researched this message and checked for something loose, but nothing is obvious. Unfortunately my normal repair tech is in the hospital. Prayers for Kelley McWeeney!!! If anyone can help, I would appreciate it. Thanks-Lou
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Offline ibis

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Re: Flintstones Gnd short Row 1 is stuck closed
« Reply #1 on: March 21, 2017, 12:56:32 PM »
Check in the manual what is on that row.  Then check all those individual items to see what is grounded.  Something is touching, could be the spade on one of the sockets touching a switch, wire, etc, etc. 

Offline Steelcurtainlou

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Re: Flintstones Gnd short Row 1 is stuck closed
« Reply #2 on: March 21, 2017, 01:27:12 PM »
Thanks for the reply. I have double checked everything in that row to see if anything was loose, broken or touching. Nothing obvious unfortunately.
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Offline tktlwyr

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Re: Flintstones Gnd short Row 1 is stuck closed
« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2017, 01:56:16 PM »
Pull the switch connectors for all four switch matrix playfield plugs from the bottom right of the CPU board (connectors J206-J209). If the error goes away, there is a playfield short. If the error stays, there is a problem on the CPU board.

Where we go from there is dependent on your response.
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Offline Steelcurtainlou

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Re: Flintstones Gnd short Row 1 is stuck closed
« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2017, 02:36:23 PM »
When I unplugged j207 and j209 (couldn't find j206 or j208) dmd says check fuses F115 and F116, J 112 and opto 12v supply. I checked fuses and they are ok. When I plugged connectors back, Gnd short message did not go away. From what I read, it could be u20 chip on board I guess?? Chip u20 looks fine, but I am not confident in taking out and resoldering a new one if that in fact is the problem. Thanks for your response and help!!!
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Offline k7

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Re: Flintstones Gnd short Row 1 is stuck closed
« Reply #5 on: March 21, 2017, 03:12:25 PM »
probably won't help, but remove the lamp from wherever you "repaired" the LED.

I've seen the bulbs cross over internally. might be that simple. or a bad socket. or a goof in the repair of the wire/ground/socket. lots of guesses...but reversing what you just did may be all you need.
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Offline tktlwyr

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Re: Flintstones Gnd short Row 1 is stuck closed
« Reply #6 on: March 21, 2017, 03:15:30 PM »
When I unplugged j207 and j209 (couldn't find j206 or j208) dmd says check fuses F115 and F116, J 112 and opto 12v supply. I checked fuses and they are ok. When I plugged connectors back, Gnd short message did not go away. From what I read, it could be u20 chip on board I guess?? Chip u20 looks fine, but I am not confident in taking out and resoldering a new one if that in fact is the problem. Thanks for your response and help!!!

Wait...is this in the lamp matrix or the switch matrix?

If it's the switch matrix (because I'm not sure I've seen this message in a lamp matrix issue), when you unplugged it and booted the machine, the ground short message went away or not?  This is critical on determining where the fault lies.  If it went away when you booted with the connectors off the CPU, it's on the playfield.  If the ground short message was still present when the connectors were off the CPU board, it's on the CPU.

If it's lamp matrix, which socket did you replace?
« Last Edit: March 21, 2017, 03:23:24 PM by tktlwyr »
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Offline Steelcurtainlou

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Re: Flintstones Gnd short Row 1 is stuck closed
« Reply #7 on: March 21, 2017, 03:25:01 PM »
Sorry for my lack of clarity!! With j207 and j209 disconnected, I booted game back on. The Gnd short message went away, but the check fuses message came on the DMD.
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Offline Steelcurtainlou

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Re: Flintstones Gnd short Row 1 is stuck closed
« Reply #8 on: March 21, 2017, 03:31:42 PM »
All switches work in test mode. When I first turn game on, the ball trough fires all balls into shooter lane. I don't think it has to do with the lamps I replaced. I checked and even took them back out to see if it would stop the Gnd short, and it didn't.
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Offline tktlwyr

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Re: Flintstones Gnd short Row 1 is stuck closed
« Reply #9 on: March 21, 2017, 03:48:12 PM »
Sorry for my lack of clarity!! With j207 and j209 disconnected, I booted game back on. The Gnd short message went away, but the check fuses message came on the DMD.

OK.  So switch matrix.

J209 is Row1, is a White/Brown wire that runs to the launch button, slam tilt, trough 1, 4 bank drop target 1, 3 bank target bottom target, left sling, and left out rollover.  To find the location of the short, go to the end of the switch row wire on the playfield (the switches are "daisy chained" together for an entire column or row). Then break the daisy chain one switch at a time until the short no longer shows in the switch test. 

If the switch isn't grounding anywhere, it's probably a bad diode.
David Paz
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Offline tktlwyr

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Re: Flintstones Gnd short Row 1 is stuck closed
« Reply #10 on: March 21, 2017, 03:50:16 PM »
All switches work in test mode. When I first turn game on, the ball trough fires all balls into shooter lane. I don't think it has to do with the lamps I replaced. I checked and even took them back out to see if it would stop the Gnd short, and it didn't.

If the machine is kicking out all the balls in the trough, it's probably trough switch 1 shorting to something or the diode.

Great tutorial:

http://pinballrehab.com/1-articles/solid-state-repair/repair-guides/146-switch-matrix-theory-and-troubleshooting
« Last Edit: March 21, 2017, 03:52:51 PM by tktlwyr »
David Paz
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Offline Steelcurtainlou

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Re: Flintstones Gnd short Row 1 is stuck closed
« Reply #11 on: March 21, 2017, 11:08:10 PM »
This is probably something easy to fix, but I cannot find the problem. If anyone local can fix this, I will be happy to pay you for your services!! Thanks to all who took the time to try and help.
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Offline ratsflif

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Re: Flintstones Gnd short Row 1 is stuck closed
« Reply #12 on: March 22, 2017, 09:03:25 AM »
Yeah you cant remove the switch matrix connectors to troubleshoot on that era pin.  I had the same issue on TAF.

This is from the pin wiki:

This message is sometimes displayed when the game boots and a game cannot be started. Most of the time, F114/F115 will be found to be just fine.
The game issues this message because it cannot read the switch matrix normally. The crafty designers at Williams inserted an “always closed“ switch into the matrix as switch 24. Switch 24 isn’t a switch at all, but instead provides the game software with a “known closed” switch matrix return. Switch 24 is actually a diode across column 2, row 4 of the switch matrix and is located on the coin door interface board.
Since the WPC switch matrix circuitry on the MPU uses 12V to determine switch state, the game assumes that the 12VDC power has been interrupted. F114/F115 fuse the 12V generation circuit; F114 on the AC side of BR1; F115 on the DC side of BR1. Hence, the game assumes that one of these fuses is blown and the message is displayed.

Offline Steelcurtainlou

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Re: Flintstones Gnd short Row 1 is stuck closed
« Reply #13 on: April 05, 2017, 10:17:41 AM »
Still haven't been able to get it working. It's been down for two months. I am willing to pay cash if anyone can do a house call. If someone can help, I would really appreciate it. Thanks-Lou
« Last Edit: April 05, 2017, 02:18:20 PM by Steelcurtainlou »
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Offline Steelcurtainlou

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Re: Flintstones Gnd short Row 1 is stuck closed
« Reply #14 on: April 10, 2017, 10:38:35 AM »
Up and running again. It was the u20 chip. Thank you Larry for your help!!
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